Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Do you ever have an emotional reaction or negative thought?
[00:00:08] Speaker B: Never.
[00:00:08] Speaker A: Well, you're human. We're all human. Never. Never. I've never done it before.
So. So as we go through life, we get triggered. Things happen to us. We have a reaction, we have a thought. You know, we might even say something, we do something, right? All these things just arise almost instantly, or you could even say within a split second, stuff just happens.
In this episode, we're diving into the fact that you can't change the first thought because it happens from the unconscious, but you can decide what to do with it and not go down one of these rabbit holes.
So this is hugely important.
[00:00:52] Speaker B: Hugely important, yes, absolutely hugely important.
[00:00:57] Speaker A: Yeah. Because what normally happens is that we go through our life, right? Something happens, or even we get triggered by something we see on our phone or outside or whatever. It could even be just in a feeling we're having. And it. Something is triggered, it causes a whole range, like, it's almost like a spiraling effect. The first thought comes, then there's the emotion, then there's another thought, then another thought, then another thought, then it can lead to actions.
And then we think, what the hell did I do that for? Why did I do it?
So this first thought comes and it creates this whole chain reaction which then can cause all kinds of problems. And this happens thousands and thousands of times.
How are we going to break the pattern?
[00:01:41] Speaker B: Yeah, good question.
[00:01:44] Speaker A: Yeah, that's the big question.
[00:01:46] Speaker B: That is the big question. That's the big question. So. So, you know, we could make it to three minutes done.
Or we could talk about this.
But if you want to talk about.
[00:02:01] Speaker A: You want. You want the three minute version? Give us the three minute version first.
[00:02:04] Speaker B: The three minute version is surrender and trust.
Surrender is.
You have to surrender your first response.
Just surrender it. It's not you, it's not your. Whatever. That's not you.
Right?
Surrender it.
And then second response is, you have to trust. You have to trust a higher self, you have to trust the other. You know, whatever the situations are going on, that it's all beneficial. You have to trust.
So that's less than three minutes.
[00:02:45] Speaker A: Well, there it is. So you can. That's it. You can go home now and nothing to worry about.
[00:02:49] Speaker B: Or they can. Or they can write, they can carry on, or they could give us some comments and tell what they think needs to happen.
[00:02:58] Speaker A: What do you think?
[00:02:59] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
So let's take this step by step. Let's. Because. Because what normally happens, right, is we go through life, we get triggered and that brings Up a thought. Now what often happens immediately after that is either we get triggered and it goes on a spiral or we get triggered and it goes on a spiral and we feel bad about ourselves because we even had the thought, you know, like, let's say something happens.
I remember seeing some political thing, actually, I'm just, I'm not going to talk about any details, but I saw something that I didn't like and I had the thought in my mind, well, it serves them right. And I hope, I hope like bad things happen to this person. Essentially. That's what I was thinking. Right. Which is not a very.
[00:03:48] Speaker B: I can't believe it, you know, I cannot believe that you would think that.
I'll tell you why.
[00:03:54] Speaker A: I know it's shocking.
[00:03:55] Speaker B: It's shocking because I've never seen you think like that.
Never. Ever.
[00:04:00] Speaker A: Never heard any. No, no. I mean, it came out of nowhere. Right. It's so. But these things happen.
[00:04:06] Speaker B: So it's not you. Right? This, this is case in point. Because would you agree, brother Michael, I know you well, I've never, never seen you think like that.
[00:04:17] Speaker A: No, I don't because I actually don't really mean that about. I, I wish people well and I like, even if I disagree with them politically or.
[00:04:25] Speaker B: I mean, I've seen people do worse bad things to you and you still gave them blessings and love.
[00:04:33] Speaker A: Yeah, because. Because I, you know, on a deeper level I care. But the thought came, I was like, serves you right. You know, I hope your crazy idea that you think you're doing goes horribly wrong and like you get seen as a fraud that you are or whatever it was. So that was the, basically the thought.
And then, and then I was like, no, no, no, that's not exactly the best thing. But so I could feel bad about myself that I had that thought, you know, so whether it's anger or greed or lust or ego or any of these things, the five vices, they come up all of a sudden and normally they get out of hand and they just go off on their whole little trip.
But we can also feel bad that I am now a bad person because I had that thought.
And if I feel my sense of who I am, my identity is based on that thought, then, then my self esteem, my whole well being is going to be sabotaged because these things come with without realizing it.
So we have to say I am separate from my thinking.
And just because I thought something doesn't mean I am a bad person.
[00:05:46] Speaker B: Right, right, right.
[00:05:49] Speaker A: It's very important. Right. Because we're still like A good soul. We just happen to have a certain thought.
[00:05:55] Speaker B: Right. And especially that you thinking that right really demonstrates that because you are a sweet person, really genuinely sweet.
And, and if you had the thought that's not you, it was just a knee jerk reaction that happened. And that's not you.
[00:06:15] Speaker A: Yeah. And I actually think some of the thoughts that we have are sort of floating around as well. Like we can.
Like I've. I've noticed certain thoughts like, where is this coming from? Like this is it. Is it like psychic attack or some weird thing floating around in there? I'm not saying all of it. I'm not saying I'm blaming it on everyone else, but I do feel we can sometimes pick up energies and thoughts that are around and then think that that's mine.
So it's. It's important. One thing that's helped me a lot with this particular topic is, is to have the attitude that it's not mine.
Like any negative thing is, is Raven's property or negative property. It's all like it. Because as soon as I think this is me, then I get all very attached to it, or this is mine.
But when I say that's just a thought that is the property of negativity and it just happened to arise, then I'm much more able to release it.
[00:07:23] Speaker B: Right, Right.
So there's.
[00:07:25] Speaker A: If I think I'm a bad person and this is my thought, then it's not going to go away.
[00:07:29] Speaker B: Yeah, there's a lot of research on this. Right.
[00:07:34] Speaker A: I'm encouraging to do research. And look what she's doing. Look at all this great research. I'm sure everyone's enjoying it. This is because it's good to know, isn't it? These aren't just spiritual principles.
[00:07:43] Speaker B: Yeah, there is a lot of research around this. And so there's a lot of research on the brain. Right. Again, I can't get the name right. Joseph, some French sounding last name.
[00:07:54] Speaker A: What he found is Joseph, some French sounding last name. He's the, he's the one to listen to people gonna start googling it.
[00:08:02] Speaker B: And so what he found is that in the brain, when responses come, the first response goes into the amygdala and that happens in milliseconds.
And then the second response, which is the choice response, goes through the prefrontal cortex, which is where you have the thinking feeling, the thinking choice part of the brain, the prefrontal cortex.
Another gentleman, I don't really remember his name either. He calls it the amygdala hijack.
And I love that word, the amygdala hijack. Right.
Because we're just getting hijacked.
And not to feel bad because we are getting hijacked. You don't blame the victim for getting hijacked.
Right? I'm not suggesting you think of yourself as a victim, but you don't. Let's say a plane is getting hijacked. You're not going to blame the passengers and say you're bad people. You got hijacked.
[00:09:15] Speaker A: No.
[00:09:17] Speaker B: So the amygdala hijack happens to everyone.
Right? And so now that's in the brain. But now let's talk about the soul, which really is where most of the things are happening and it's being projected onto the brain because the brain is just a projection of what's happening inside the soul.
And so inside the soul also, the same thing is happening. There's a knee jerk reaction and that lets for a lack of a better world, which I love the word amygdala hijack.
Right?
[00:09:52] Speaker A: Beautiful, beautiful term.
[00:09:53] Speaker B: So we have an amygdala hijack.
Wherever it's happening in the soul, in the brain, the spiritual amygdala hijack is happening.
And we don't have a choice, right? We think a certain way and we don't have a choice. And to surrender that.
Just surrender? Yes. I don't have a choice. I thought this way. I don't have a choice because that surrender creates the pause.
And that pause really is what we need to have a better second response.
We need a pause.
Right. Even Viktor Frankl said no in his man's search for meaning. I remember that sentence so beautifully.
And it's like the best. I feel the best advertisement for meditation is between what's happening to you. I'm not paraphrasing this, of course. Between what's happening to you and what you need to do, the choices you need to make. There is a space, you have to create that space.
And that space is what we need to create for ourselves.
Because the second response is our choice and we can make a really good choice. But if we don't create the pause, we don't surrender and create that pause, then nothing's going to happen again. The second response will be very similar to the first response.
[00:11:35] Speaker A: Exactly. It's a bit like going out into the cold.
Like if it gets cold, right? That's not your fault, is it? I mean, like it's got cold here, it was raining.
I'm, I'm. There's nothing I can do about the rain, right?
But I can decide to wear Appropriate clothing, Right? That's. That's a choice. I can say, oh, I, I'm. I went outside and it's cold. Oh, no. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. And then start to get freezing outside, right? That's. That's kind of what we're talking about. Or I can say, it's cold, let me go back in the house, get some proper gear on, right? And a hat, and then go out again.
Because we can decide to choose the second thought, the third thought, the. The fourth thought. We can decide to do all kinds of things.
We don't have to go along with this.
[00:12:28] Speaker B: Yeah, we don't have to. The hijacking is out of our control, right? The amygdala hijack is totally out of our control.
But the second choice. The second one is our choice.
The second one is our choice. And so for the first one, I feel we need surrender, which creates the pause, because don't think that's you. It's just a hijacked version of something you are not.
And then the second one, for the second one, I feel we need three steps to understand the second response, right?
The second response, the first step is that I am, like, my original nature is a very high soul. It's like a very high level soul. I'm a very high level soul, right? That's the trust I need to have. That is, my original nature is I'm a supremely wonderful soul.
And that's a really important trust, right? Because a lot of people can tell you a lot of things.
A lot of things have happened in our lives which keep telling us differently, but that's not true.
What's true is you're a very beautiful soul.
You're a beautiful, peaceful, wonderful being.
And you have to trust that.
That your joy, your kindness, your simplicity, your lightness, your everything.
You have to trust that that's who you are.
[00:14:13] Speaker A: Sounds like it's two steps really, isn't it? One is, you get hijacked. This. So let's. Let's keep with this analogy a little bit, right? We get. Let's imagine you're going somewhere and you get hijacked, right?
It's not a permanent hijacking. There is a way out of the hijacking. If you just did this one thing or you went over here, you're no longer hijacked. Right? It's.
But. But most of the time, people are not thinking about any other option other than just going along with it.
You know, like, imagine you were hijacked, like in.
In, let's say, a Building got hijacked. Right. But there's a door where anyone who wants to go out of the door is no longer a captive. Right. They can just leave. Right? There it is. There's the door there.
But if we are stuck in that and we're freaking out about it and thinking, oh, my, what am I gonna do? What I'm gonna do? Nothing I do about it. We stay there.
What we're talking about is how do you get out after you've been hijacked? And we might. So you get hijacked and then you leave. You might get hijacked again.
You have to leave again.
[00:15:19] Speaker B: So hijack is one. Right.
Then to leave to exit is that. These are the steps to exit.
[00:15:27] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:15:27] Speaker B: These are the steps. The first step is you have to trust that you are a supremely wonderful, beautiful, loving, kind, a powerful soul.
[00:15:42] Speaker A: Yeah. In other words, it's not me like that. What's happened to me. And what I'm thinking is not absolutely, because that. That's. That's the. That's the key problem is I'm thinking this thought, therefore I'm bad.
It happens almost immediately, you know, so we have to say, no, no, it's happening like it's clouds moving past, or it's happening like there's traffic moving or that something happened outside.
That doesn't mean I am bad because of that.
That's really important.
[00:16:15] Speaker B: Right.
[00:16:16] Speaker A: To make that distinction.
[00:16:18] Speaker B: Right. Second step.
So second step is that clarity. Clarity is your original nature.
Because what happens is with the amygdala hijack, and the amygdala response is it creates a fog.
Right. It's almost like, if you notice your IQ at that point, it will be significantly less because it's creating a fog inside.
But clarity is your original nature.
So once you allow yourself to understand clarity is my original nature. I can think clearly. This is who I am.
Then the fog starts lifting.
Then the exit becomes very obvious. Otherwise, the exit is camouflaged by the fog of whatever, you know, the amygdala hijack.
[00:17:24] Speaker A: And we have to surrender. Surrender to God immediately. I mean, one thing that's helped me profoundly is surrender whatever is coming up the moment it arises.
Because the quicker the better, right? Because you have to remember that the longer we wait to. To do any. Any work on ourselves when we have these thoughts or feelings, the longer we wait, the harder it is to change it.
So the. The sooner we can surrender it, the better it is because there's less to surrender. Right? Because if. If a thought comes and I say immediately, let it Go, I'm a soul. And I let it go.
It hasn't got out of hand at that point. It's just a thought. But if I think it again and again and again and again and again for days and weeks and months, then it's a serious, serious problem, you know, Enormous amount of work, you know, so it's like it comes up and immediately let it go, let it go, let it go, let it go, let it go, let it go. I'm totally different from this. I'm originally pure and good.
Ah, there it is.
[00:18:29] Speaker B: All right, third step, quick.
Yeah, Third step is like what you said, right? You're not one of. You're not the trigger, you're not the thought. But not only that, but the third step is to watch as a detached observer is you have to create emotional and identifying space between you and your triggers, right? Your identity shouldn't be your triggers. There has to be a space, and that's called a detached observer. Don't create a story, right? No. Stories don't create meaning.
You know, I had this thought, so I'm horrible. Don't create meaning.
Don't create. I had this thought, so someone else is horrible. None of that stuff. So you're being a detached observer. Being a detached observer, the Sakshi stage, right? You're just being aware of yourself as a soul. There's no story, no interpretation going on, and you are just watching what is going on.
Interestingly, paradoxically, because you've become a detached observer, you have a better chance of the second response that your second response will be very elevated and high, where it will give you peace and joy.
[00:19:56] Speaker A: Ah, peace and joy. Peace and joy, yes. It's going from being the actor and the kind of creator of everything to being the witness, observer of it.
So instead of it's me, me, me, me, me. I create all this stuff. It's. I am the space that is watching it all from a distance.
And you go, oh, that's interesting. So it's. The key thing is to remove any sense of I out of this situation, because that. That's where the attachment to it, the ownership of it is, where it's very hard to release it.
It's a bit like if there was a dog barking outside.
I'm not gonna get really upset about it. I mean, I don't like dogs barking, actually. But I can just watch it and go, oh, there's a dog barking. It doesn't mean I'm a dog.
Doesn't mean I'm a bad dog. He's a bad Dog. You know, none of that, you know, I mean, I'm just watching it over there, hearing it over there.
That's so important to have that space.
[00:21:05] Speaker B: You know, one of the most important things in all of this, which you just reminded me, you just said something and it reminded me about the I.
Is ego.
The ego is so insidious.
Ego really is telling you, oh, you are that first, you know, thing.
You are the first reaction. And. And also, not only you're the first reaction. You start blaming people. Oh, because of everyone else, this is happening.
And then you start becoming a victim. Oh, because of whatever this is, you know, victim. Or you think everyone's an idiot. You know, this and that, you know, so both sides of the ego. Right. You think you're not enough or you think you're the best ever, and so better than everyone else. And so what happens is ego, to really get rid of ego, is a very high destination.
Very high destination. Right. We use the word body consciousness in our terminology where the soul is either aware of itself as a soul, and when the soul is aware of itself as a soul, then it's soul consciousness.
And the soul thinks it's the body, it's unconsciously thinking it's the body, and that's body consciousness.
And so I've been interchanging body consciousness with the ego, because why am I thinking I'm the body because of ego.
There's a lot of that going around, and it's way beyond the scope of this podcast to talk about how to get rid of ego, because that's.
That's very advanced level spirituality.
[00:23:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:06] Speaker B: And I will tell you when I got rid of it.
So stay tuned till I get rid of it.
Till then, not talking about it.
[00:23:16] Speaker A: There's no ego. There's no ego. Well, the one thing that we can. That helps a little bit with this is the ego fundamentally, is all about being right.
It wants to prove itself right all the time. It always has. My opinion is the best. I'm right about everything. Everything should be the way I like it. Or even if it's like insecurity, it's still being right about something in one way or another.
So if we can say I don't need to be right or the first.
[00:23:43] Speaker B: Response is not right.
Right. I don't.
I don't get attached to the first response.
[00:23:51] Speaker A: Right.
[00:23:51] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't need to be the first response. It's not right.
[00:23:55] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's just coming up. And the reason we don't like certain things is because we're like, well, I expect myself, I have an idea of who I am and I expect myself to act in a certain way. And if anything else happens, then it's like, oh dear, they get all upset about it and it shouldn't be like this. It should be like this. Most of the reactions against something we in, in our life is because I don't like it the way it is. It should be different. And I'm. I know better.
You know, like this political example that I mentioned earlier, I had an idea what I think is right in my, in my arrogance about what I think should be going on in politics.
And something else was happening and that's what created that thought.
Because I wanted to be right. Because I know best. Because if everyone did whatever thing I'm talking about, then everything will be fine.
But of course, if I was in charge of America politically, I'm sure it would be terrible.
[00:25:02] Speaker B: No, but I want to say something because I don't. Politics.
[00:25:06] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:25:07] Speaker B: I feel that we are being manipulated into the division. It's like a divide and rule, right. There's this division of the right and the left and this and that. And then they. All right, big business, like big business, big companies, right. Because they are the ones who own most of media and stuff.
They amplify the worst in the other.
They amplify it, right.
And then because they want to get, trigger this reaction out of people and they want to separate people. Right. Inherently all Democrats are bad, or if you're a Republican, inherently all Democrats are bad or if you're a Democrat inherently all Republicans are stupid.
Something like that. Right.
That's what is happening. But we have to see who's the puppet, who's creating this, who's amplifying the worst in the other.
I know we are going off tangent, but it's not really up.
[00:26:19] Speaker A: No, but this is the whole thing, isn't it? Where do these thoughts come from? Who's causing the thoughts? You know, and so we have to surrender it up and say, I'm nothing to do with any of this stuff. I'm a spiritual being and I don't need to be right. I don't need to prove my point. I can just be the witness, be in peace and surrender it to God. Surrender it to God. Surrender it to God the moment it arises and be this, the spacious, graceful light that we are.
Because if we don't do that, we're just going to get caught up in one thing or another and get upset about it.
So yeah, this is a, it's a Huge topic. So basically, what are you going to do with this? Practically next time you get triggered, which is probably going to happen, you might even be triggered listening to us. I don't know.
[00:27:15] Speaker B: Of course all Democrats are horrible, and of course all Republicans are bad.
[00:27:20] Speaker A: And brother Michael will be the best president. What are you talking about? No, I'm just joking. So it's like we don't know the whole spectrum of everything in the world and everything in life. We don't know all the details of everything. Let's at least acknowledge that. Right. We don't have all the answers to everything.
So that helps a little bit of humility.
And so things come up and we say, all right, I'm noticing it arising.
I'm. There's nothing. I'm not bad because I'm having a thought.
And now I'm choosing to get out of this hijacked situation by surrendering it to God.
Surrender, surrender, surrender. Realize that I'm a spiritual being. And then I can choose the second thought.
I can redirect it.
I can have a new second thought. You can't change the first thought, but you can change the second thought and then the third thought and then the fourth thought. And then if the original thought comes back again, then you have to surrender it and change. Change the second thought again and again and again. And you just do this enough times and then it. That trigger oftentimes will go away because you've already reprogrammed yourself.
It's easier. Once you've done it a bunch of times, it still might come back. You might come up back for years and years and years, but we just keep letting it go. Letting it go, letting it go with a sense of humor.
[00:28:44] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:28:45] Speaker A: And if you catch yourself getting too upset, then you just have to say, I am right. I am right. I'm right. I'm right.
Just to amuse yourself about.
[00:28:52] Speaker B: Also, let's remember the three steps too. Right, the three steps. Step one is trust. Trust that you are a supremely pure soul, supremely powerful, spiritually powerful soul. Trust that. Step number two is clarity, is your original nature. The fog that's the first thought is created.
That's just a fog. You can see through it clearly. You have the ability to see through it clearly. And you will use that ability to see through it clearly. That's step number two.
And step number three is watch as a detached observer.
Create a emotional space, thinking space, feeling space, physical space between your thoughts and. And you. The soul, just. They're there and you're just watching as a detached observer.
[00:29:50] Speaker A: Yeah. So let us know in the comments what you learned from this.
See what happens. This is a wonderful practice.
And don't take yourself too seriously. I think that's the main thing.
If we take ourselves too seriously, then we can't let go very easily.
[00:30:09] Speaker B: Right?
Right.
[00:30:12] Speaker A: Yes. So let's have a blessing.
[00:30:14] Speaker B: This is God's blessing for you.
Okay. Do we have a number or.
[00:30:22] Speaker A: You can just pick it. Let's surrender to the correct blessing.
[00:30:26] Speaker B: Okay. Self respect or self sovereignty?
[00:30:33] Speaker A: They're both good, aren't they?
[00:30:35] Speaker B: I like self sovereignty. This is beautiful.
The blessing is beautiful.
So this is God's blessing for you. Self sovereignty.
You have created a safe, loving kingdom within yourself, ruling your heart and mind with joy.
You lead your inner realm with gentleness and strength.
Your internal conversations are filled with benevolence and encouragement.
[00:31:15] Speaker A: Ah. What else do you need?
So thank you, Shereen. Thank you everyone for listening, watching. I'd love to hear what you think. Think and just remember, you're not your thoughts.
Lots of love and many blessings.
